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Discussion: Assisted Suicide
Howdy folks, it's that again; your weekly Venture Bros. discussion thread. Feel free to say whatever you like about the latest episode, "Assisted Suicide". Newcomers be warned, if you haven't seen the episode yet, the comments will contain spoilers, so enter at your own risk!
And for those of you who may have missed it, you can still enter to win a Brock Samson shirt and don't forget to vote in round two of Heroes & Scientists.
And for those of you who may have missed it, you can still enter to win a Brock Samson shirt and don't forget to vote in round two of Heroes & Scientists.
- by Mogo
- (unregistered id: B50DB16F10)
I doubt it but the whole man of the hour thing was probably an afterthought itself. he really just wanted an orgy or something and really didn't care what his friends did. Alot of people acuse Rusty of being a crap parent(and well he is) but Rusty at least has gotten better and has freinds who treat the boys pretty well instead of putting a gun to there head in the middle of the night and dropping his pants not to remove ants.
- by Jory
- (unregistered id: 9F1235068D)
To expound, however slightly: Watching this episode was a really strange experience. Honestly, the episode just felt dead. The writing, editing, direction and animation all were so shoddy and poorly timed that it didn't even feel like the Venture Bros. (I still love you J&D)
The plot and symbolism made perfectly good sense, but seemed forced and slipshod. I hope that repeat viewings reveal some more interesting ideas... there seemed to be some potential in the Monarch's internalized usurper/deceiver role for some philosophical insight, and I enjoy the basic Freudian psychology, but the way they were utilized in the episode felt gimmicky. Even Doc's post-credit speech was just totally limp.
Again, I'll need to watch again in order to give the Astrobase boys more credit than this, but the show came across as having been terribly rushed.
The plot and symbolism made perfectly good sense, but seemed forced and slipshod. I hope that repeat viewings reveal some more interesting ideas... there seemed to be some potential in the Monarch's internalized usurper/deceiver role for some philosophical insight, and I enjoy the basic Freudian psychology, but the way they were utilized in the episode felt gimmicky. Even Doc's post-credit speech was just totally limp.
Again, I'll need to watch again in order to give the Astrobase boys more credit than this, but the show came across as having been terribly rushed.
- by Drew McManus
- (unregistered id: 5A42F2B454)
I agree that it came across a bit rushed and it seems like they had to suffer under the weight of overly judicious editing. IT seems like there was a lot more going on in the script but it didn't make it into the final cut. I hope a longer version is available in the DVD release. I'd be happy for a storyboard version with voice over to fill in the gaps
- by Xoinx
- (unregistered id: 6A16CE2D52)
Huh. It's my favorite ep of the season so far. I mean, it had *everyone* in it, including 21 acting & talking like the 21 we all know & love. Lotsa yuks, some plot advancement (FINALLY, 21 makes his move!), and further insight into Rusty's psyche. As always, I'd have wanted a longer ep, but I found more to enjoy in this one than in the rest so far this season.
- by Tricky
- (unregistered id: DD4B52F3B9)
Yeah, next time I'm watching it fucking high on chronic, I need to open my doors of perception to understand what the fuck was going on there with Rusty's mind full of open doors & haunting dead Deans & Hanks that just wanna hug people & leave poop everywhere.
Still, Sheila, is her real name Sheila?, & Gary getting all kissy-faced, I knew it'd happen eventually. 21's really been picking up so much confidence since he lost 24, he was bound to quit pretending at it & finally make a real play on the Monarch's wife.
Still, Sheila, is her real name Sheila?, & Gary getting all kissy-faced, I knew it'd happen eventually. 21's really been picking up so much confidence since he lost 24, he was bound to quit pretending at it & finally make a real play on the Monarch's wife.
- by Johnny Israel
- (unregistered id: F0E3F55FF9)
I can't explain things that well. Firstly, the dead boys weren't really there. The whole episode is the goings on of Rusty's mind. They symbolized bad memories and baggage. Dr. O basically saved the day by filling Rusty's mind with love (Eros aka Billy) and The best perceived notion of himself (SuperEgo). Google Id, Ego, and SuperEgo. The whole stems from this.
- by Matt F.
- (unregistered id: 6AAFDAFC33)
"I've seen attack ships on fire off the shoreline"
Minute I heard that I screamed "Bladerunner!".
Hilarious episode. Only Doc could throw in those classic 80's references.
P.S. Good to see Garry get his confidence level up and go full ID mode on Monarch's wife! Hope it matures into something more, preferably hand to hand/weapon to weapon combat with the mighty Monarch himself.
Minute I heard that I screamed "Bladerunner!".
Hilarious episode. Only Doc could throw in those classic 80's references.
P.S. Good to see Garry get his confidence level up and go full ID mode on Monarch's wife! Hope it matures into something more, preferably hand to hand/weapon to weapon combat with the mighty Monarch himself.
- by Tricky
- (unregistered id: DD4B52F3B9)
It was nice to see 21 & her getting kissy but I hope they just leave it be & don't do it no more. The Monarch's a mad possessive evil SOB & I'd for him & 21 to have to kill each other because, Malcolm's so jealous that he won't listen to reason & he holds a grudge forever.
It's just best if his wife & 21 just keep it as their little secret & 21 finds his own girl, not that I'm not happy & proud of 21 for making a move on the Mrs, just that I like the dynamic between the 2 of them & would hate to see it forever gone.
It's just best if his wife & 21 just keep it as their little secret & 21 finds his own girl, not that I'm not happy & proud of 21 for making a move on the Mrs, just that I like the dynamic between the 2 of them & would hate to see it forever gone.
- by Mogo
- (unregistered id: 9E0AAE930F)
That was specatucalr. and way to go 21 and i'll see you at your funeral. And anyways to explain some of the more meta stuff that went over somepeoples head.
*The three rustys were the manafestations of the three aspects of a human freud talked about ego(the logic), Id(the implusie and emotion) and superego(the best of both worlds, damn you miley cyrus).
*The thing escaping was death. I think.
*Billy and Pete were love and death, the non mind rapey kind.
*And finally the boys were as orpehous put it, the manefestations of all of rustys cloning guilt.
*The three rustys were the manafestations of the three aspects of a human freud talked about ego(the logic), Id(the implusie and emotion) and superego(the best of both worlds, damn you miley cyrus).
*The thing escaping was death. I think.
*Billy and Pete were love and death, the non mind rapey kind.
*And finally the boys were as orpehous put it, the manefestations of all of rustys cloning guilt.
- by andrew
- (unregistered id: BF0B9E9909)
i still attest to the idea of the Monarch, in collage, either had a crush on Rusty or was his biggest fan, and one day tried to express his feelings to him. Then in a typical Rusty way, he shot him down in the worst possible way and which hurt him deeply. Which is where I think all the piss and vinegar comes from. but I'm sure this is wrong
- by beb
- (unregistered id: A678E20E7F)
Not just attending the same college, but already trying to blow Rusty up. I like the idea of Rusty and the Monarch being brothers but there's no way to make the timelines work out. The best one could do was have the Monarch's mother having an affair with Jonas Sr behind her husband's back, so they would be half-brothers. But I suspect that the Monarch is just a thwarted Boy Adventurer and has turned his once love for Rusty into hatred.
- by Mogo
- (unregistered id: B50DB16F10)
The mind rape was as dr.girlfreind put it "Mind Assasian"(and apperently a guild name). He basically used a machine to go into his head like Dr.O did with magic, and was trying to destroy him from within, that's why dr.venture kept trying to kill himself, the monarch was trying to either murder him or drive him insane. And since theres obviously almost no defense against this(most super scientests and super heros probably don't have necromancer paying them rent) that's probably why the guild banned it. But for whatever reason the monarch decided to do it anyway.
- by The Mysterious 'H'
- (unregistered id: 43F7869F5C)
I saw it but it's very out of the Monarch's character to try to actually kill Rusty. He usually just tries to make his life miserable, the whole tet-a-tet thing. He's so invested in hating Dr. Venture that he falls apart without him. It's like the Joker without Batman or Lex Luthor without Superman.
- by obvious
- (unregistered id: B3C652485F)
because he wanted to get rusty to kill himself. the psychic lock orpheus put on rusty unfortunately kinda started messing with the monarch since the brain was no longer functional or habitable. the clone boys was enough of a reason for him to "want to get out of there".
how he did it....mind machine. he used a mindmachine. it's highly illegal and against guild rules.
how he did it....mind machine. he used a mindmachine. it's highly illegal and against guild rules.
- by Mira
- (unregistered id: 584C0C1C72)
I wonder who the pink haired nurse in the Id's harem was? Mayhaps just a stripper, I guess...Strange that there was no Nikki, though. Although I guess maybe she isn't really a sex symbol to him anymore after the whole thing with her pregnancy, and not having seen her in like, seventeen years...although clearly amount of time passed isn't necessarily an issue...
- by Drew McManus
- (unregistered id: 5A42F2B454)
- by Hardy
- (unregistered id: FFF530337A)
Why does everyone question why Nikki wasn't on the Id's bed?? He hasn't seen her in 17 years and back then it didn't seem Rusty lusted for her...she was all over HIM! As of today his image of her is as a 15 year-old-girl which is not what he's into. It all makes sense to me.
However if he ever figured out who Dermott was and found out how HOT Nikki is today in her early 30's....she'd take up the whole bed.
However if he ever figured out who Dermott was and found out how HOT Nikki is today in her early 30's....she'd take up the whole bed.
- by Hemlock
- (unregistered id: 9BB76C5938)
What I think is most relevant is that Dr. Orpheus succeeded in his task and unlocked Rusty's superego. The end credits speech was possibly the most open and frank thing he had ever said to Hank in the entire series. Dean got a bit of it back in Perchance to Dean. But it required the superego to finally open himself to Hank.
Now that he's done both (and conquered his subconscious fear with the recloning), perhaps he's going to start doing a lot less failing and a lot more succeeding. I think the overall theme to the show has officially shifted.
Now that he's done both (and conquered his subconscious fear with the recloning), perhaps he's going to start doing a lot less failing and a lot more succeeding. I think the overall theme to the show has officially shifted.
- by Tricky
- (unregistered id: DD4B52F3B9)
I would think so too, that his super ego is finally free & Rusty might finally escape his failure, but his little speech at the end puts the kibosh on that whole idea.
He loves his failure of a life, he can't help but to relive his real nightmares in order to define himself as the loser that he has become. Even if he's conscious of what went on his brain & how he could've possibly went insane but didn't, he doesn't care cause the worse that that happened to him was when at his 16th birthday his Dad's friends shrunk his dick in front of a room full of the most beautiful women in the world.
All will contiue to be as it ever was in the Ventureverse. ;)
He loves his failure of a life, he can't help but to relive his real nightmares in order to define himself as the loser that he has become. Even if he's conscious of what went on his brain & how he could've possibly went insane but didn't, he doesn't care cause the worse that that happened to him was when at his 16th birthday his Dad's friends shrunk his dick in front of a room full of the most beautiful women in the world.
All will contiue to be as it ever was in the Ventureverse. ;)
- by ijka
- (unregistered id: 5F519E1C53)
interesting episode,
I kinda worry about what they are going to do with The Monarch/21/Mrs. The Monarch love triangle... there is no way that that won't come up in the final episodes.
Breaking up Dr. Girlfriend/The Monarch would ruin a pretty amusing tandem, and take the show down a road its already freaking been down before. Killing off 21 would be ridiculously rash. 21 staying on as a loyal body guard after all thats happened this season seems unlikely... so what happens? he goes off and becomes teh viceroy for real?
I kinda worry about what they are going to do with The Monarch/21/Mrs. The Monarch love triangle... there is no way that that won't come up in the final episodes.
Breaking up Dr. Girlfriend/The Monarch would ruin a pretty amusing tandem, and take the show down a road its already freaking been down before. Killing off 21 would be ridiculously rash. 21 staying on as a loyal body guard after all thats happened this season seems unlikely... so what happens? he goes off and becomes teh viceroy for real?
- by Mogo
- (unregistered id: 9E0AAE930F)
Exactly. This can not end well. Period. But you have to understand the monarch has had this coming for a LONG time. He's done what limb did and forgot her as a partner some of the time but with 21 it's worse... he's given him nothing but loyalty, even when he went to prison he was ready, and he in all probabiltiy kidnapped him at 15. That's probably true. And the monarchs treated him like another henchman and passed his best freind, who by the way was proabbly his first henchman , a fact that 21 already knows. The first season ended with him loosing dr.girlffrend, the second was about him winning her back after his lowest point, the thrid was his obsession with dr.venture and this season he's at the top and so's 21 but we finally see what that's cost him.
- by Mogo
- (unregistered id: B50DB16F10)
Right plus brock is there well mother figure, the side that acually cares about them opsed to rustys distant and sometimes dowright abusve attitude. He still cares about the boys and besides being a former child molester Hatreds also inept most of the time. Plus theres the whole being right there for months and not being able to let the boys know he was only a short walk away was really hard on the ol brockodile.
- by model T. Wrex
- (unregistered id: E59F910C35)
that was ron howard's bro?
people in the room go: who? linsay wagger? who is that?
this is ready for a part 2. seems like so much more couldve been explored, like the insanity of deleted scenes from the movie "forbidden planet" (father love gets weird) and what leviathan is, the traditional dragon with giant scales like in the bible, or maybe action man, with the ray gun. couldve gone on longer. easy 2 hr episode. rusty's adventure is a leviathan part 1-4.
ya everyone, drink the tronya. you get to first base.
people in the room go: who? linsay wagger? who is that?
this is ready for a part 2. seems like so much more couldve been explored, like the insanity of deleted scenes from the movie "forbidden planet" (father love gets weird) and what leviathan is, the traditional dragon with giant scales like in the bible, or maybe action man, with the ray gun. couldve gone on longer. easy 2 hr episode. rusty's adventure is a leviathan part 1-4.
ya everyone, drink the tronya. you get to first base.
- by Wemedge
- (unregistered id: 6DB93164E5)
Anyone else seem to think this episode would have worked better as a two parter? After Orpheus reaches the Superego, the episode accelerated to Ludicrous Speed and ended way to abruptly for me. Who didn't want to see them navigate the air ducts of despair or whatever to reach Rusty's mind?
- by GrimGravy
- (unregistered id: 1B8661F6D0)
That...was a lot. It was a good lot, but the bump before the show mentioned this was originally a C plot. It probably should have either stayed that way or our beloved AstroBase should have left the idea in the oven a little longer to execute it a little less franticly confusing.
- by model T. Wrex
- (unregistered id: F4D8CB8008)
ya, i agree, would be good if there was a part 6 coming out, skip parts 2-5. the shaving cream as suicide really was amazing though. that part had me laughing.
this guy is a dead ringer henchman, between bad haircut, accent, and shitty blue screen. set phasers on fail win:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-z4iw8Ppo1o
this guy is a dead ringer henchman, between bad haircut, accent, and shitty blue screen. set phasers on fail win:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-z4iw8Ppo1o
- by PromoTheRobot
- (unregistered id: 0B3D50F846)
So happy to see Sheila and Gary finally make it. I envision those two dumping Malcolm Monarch and forming their own more successful super-villain duo. Oh I 'm sure there will be a Monarch/21 showdown but don't sell the new Gary short, especially with 24 having his back. You wouldn't expect a hottie like Dr. Girlfriend to fall for a shlub like 21 but I think she has never had a man care for her like he does
- by The Mysterious 'H'
- (unregistered id: 43F7869F5C)
Here is something I've been thinking about- this episode was written before DB vs BG (note that the moppets are still in Pupa Twins attire). What does that say about 21 getting his first solo command and the bar scene in that episode? Should we look at this in airing order or production order?
- by Mike
- (unregistered id: DA1A2954DF)
Continuity-wise the episode takes place after Diving Bell. Hank's hair being the most obvious thing to look at. Airing order is generally the intended order with the exception of the original airing of season one and Assassinanny 911 was out of order in season two. The way they are listed on the sidebar here is the intended order (though obviously the seasons are in reverse). They just write them out of order a lot of the time.
- by Mike
- (unregistered id: DA1A2954DF)
- by Drew McManus
- (unregistered id: 5A42F2B454)
- by Mike
- (unregistered id: DA1A2954DF)
I don't even think it's that, he cares about them enough and knows that he's a poor enough father to implement cloning at all. If anything I think having the stockpile of clones made him a worse father then he is now (like telling Hank to be careful opening strange boxes in "Blood of the Father").
Really I think his detachment from them is because he's completely self-absorbed and even bordering on delusional at times. And then because of his extraordinarily bizarre upbringing and the no doubt hefty expectations his father placed upon him he's completely messed up and probably not capable of attaching himself to his own sons, almost similar to how his father was with him. He doesn't know how to be a dad because he doesn't have a single normal point of reference. Brock and Sgt. Hatred are better at being fathers than he which is completely sad given how each of them is.
I think realistically Doc never had a chance to be normal. Sadly he was destined for failure.
Really I think his detachment from them is because he's completely self-absorbed and even bordering on delusional at times. And then because of his extraordinarily bizarre upbringing and the no doubt hefty expectations his father placed upon him he's completely messed up and probably not capable of attaching himself to his own sons, almost similar to how his father was with him. He doesn't know how to be a dad because he doesn't have a single normal point of reference. Brock and Sgt. Hatred are better at being fathers than he which is completely sad given how each of them is.
I think realistically Doc never had a chance to be normal. Sadly he was destined for failure.
- by Dave
- (unregistered id: 3024E956C4)
- by Mike
- (unregistered id: DA1A2954DF)
- by Pineboxed Female Halbino 9000
- (unregistered id: 47F65E60E3)
Problems with continuity: shirts on and off. See if you can find them! Not Shore Leave! Watch again!
What was behind the giant door? Insanity running master control, up for grabs? Outtakes from the "Diving Bell vs the Butter Glider"?
Oh boy...I'm going to make some enemies, but here goes. I sure hate Lost. A show where nothing happens except other TV show plots coming in (Rod Serling wuz here) and out (maybe we're in Philip K. Dick territory, nah..), usually with the same arguments you would hear on The View. "3 different opinionions and a moderator."
Maybe it got better after season 1.
What was behind the giant door? Insanity running master control, up for grabs? Outtakes from the "Diving Bell vs the Butter Glider"?
Oh boy...I'm going to make some enemies, but here goes. I sure hate Lost. A show where nothing happens except other TV show plots coming in (Rod Serling wuz here) and out (maybe we're in Philip K. Dick territory, nah..), usually with the same arguments you would hear on The View. "3 different opinionions and a moderator."
Maybe it got better after season 1.
- by v
- (unregistered id: DF6DA855D7)
it was a great episode.
this voyage to rusty's mind informed a lot about the doctor. for exemple, the fact that he has guilt for the cloning of the kids. there was a episode that he said that the cloning was like a safety net for the kids, something positive. knowing now about this guilt, we can see how this haunt him. and is nice to see his ego using something of his id. id is psych energy, maybe now, with the ego interference, rusty will make more with himself. even more with free superego.I noticed also that his superego has hair, muscles but don't use the "clothes of cientist", like the alternate rusty or superhero clothes. just the simple venture suit
this voyage to rusty's mind informed a lot about the doctor. for exemple, the fact that he has guilt for the cloning of the kids. there was a episode that he said that the cloning was like a safety net for the kids, something positive. knowing now about this guilt, we can see how this haunt him. and is nice to see his ego using something of his id. id is psych energy, maybe now, with the ego interference, rusty will make more with himself. even more with free superego.I noticed also that his superego has hair, muscles but don't use the "clothes of cientist", like the alternate rusty or superhero clothes. just the simple venture suit
- by Chris98vf
- (unregistered id: 03E445CBBE)
Here's a link to the G-A-R-Y Cheer I made into a short MP3 for a buddy of mine named Gary. If any of you are named Gary, your welcome lol
http://stashbox.org/1020574/G-A-R-Y.mp3
http://stashbox.org/1020574/G-A-R-Y.mp3
- by Waynooski
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