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The Buddy System -- Discussion!
As is the custom, you should be able to find The Buddy System on Adult Swim.com's video section. Use the comments here to talk about it! And of course, there will be spoilers, so if you haven't seen it yet, stay out of the comments (unless you don't mind being spoiled). Enjoy the weekend!
Update: Apparently the AS.com video is having some issues. The second part is corrupt and will stop working with 2:41 left. What you can do is watch the following clips in order: Hi, Buddy!, Unbeatable Advice, Just Say The Word! and E-Den. Once the last one finishes you can skip to the third part of the main show. Many thanks to cuavsfan in the comments for finding that fix.
Update: Apparently the AS.com video is having some issues. The second part is corrupt and will stop working with 2:41 left. What you can do is watch the following clips in order: Hi, Buddy!, Unbeatable Advice, Just Say The Word! and E-Den. Once the last one finishes you can skip to the third part of the main show. Many thanks to cuavsfan in the comments for finding that fix.
- by Doc Kneezy
- (unregistered id: 003AA77818)
Why is this show on [adult swim] for???? It should be on the "Greatest fucking Tv Shows" network. This episode FUCKING ROCKS!!!! It might be the best one of all time. Dean kicking that kids ass was exactly what I was looking for in this season. I just wanted to laugh at him doing something funny and now my wish has come true. If the 3rd season gets any better my head might fuckin explode........
- by cuavsfan
- (unregistered id: EC635F2DC2)
Using that (temporary) fix from above I got through the episode... I didn't have any problems after the second part. Here's that same link as a tinurl in case the one at the top doesn't work:
http://tinyurl.com/5kkzm7
Moving on to the actual episode...
This week's shirt: Rusty bulb shirt seems obvious to me
Fun stuff:
that's a teen-ager (Hank's pronunciation)
Brock Sampson's Blood Judo
Mention of some so called "Venture Bros" cartoon!
order of the triad safety speech
The Monarch trying to get a screen capture
Hank's gi from Assasinanny911
"You would not believe how many pirate costumes I have."
Rusty cloned that kid.
And on the "what are the Moppets up to front":
Dr. Mrs. the Monarch plotting with the Moppets against the Monarch (though she is probably just trying to keep him away from Dr. Venture)
And on the "father" front:
Further evidence of Rusty being Hank's father. (He doesn't want to ruin the kid's image of him by letting them know he's had sex.)
Rusty tells Brock he'll understand when he has kids... leading into the penultimate part of the episode...
Dermitt's (sp?) real father? Brock?
http://tinyurl.com/5kkzm7
Moving on to the actual episode...
This week's shirt: Rusty bulb shirt seems obvious to me
Fun stuff:
that's a teen-ager (Hank's pronunciation)
Brock Sampson's Blood Judo
Mention of some so called "Venture Bros" cartoon!
order of the triad safety speech
The Monarch trying to get a screen capture
Hank's gi from Assasinanny911
"You would not believe how many pirate costumes I have."
Rusty cloned that kid.
And on the "what are the Moppets up to front":
Dr. Mrs. the Monarch plotting with the Moppets against the Monarch (though she is probably just trying to keep him away from Dr. Venture)
And on the "father" front:
Further evidence of Rusty being Hank's father. (He doesn't want to ruin the kid's image of him by letting them know he's had sex.)
Rusty tells Brock he'll understand when he has kids... leading into the penultimate part of the episode...
Dermitt's (sp?) real father? Brock?
- by Tess
- (unregistered id: 378D72422E)
Dr. Quymm is another super scientist.
She is in the face book the monarch is looking at in Home Is Where the Hate Is.
I don't think the woman driving the car was her.
That would be a little incestuous as well, since I heard Dr. Venture was going to have sex with Dr. Qwymn. But I might be mistaken.
She is in the face book the monarch is looking at in Home Is Where the Hate Is.
I don't think the woman driving the car was her.
That would be a little incestuous as well, since I heard Dr. Venture was going to have sex with Dr. Qwymn. But I might be mistaken.
- by Hol
- (unregistered id: 370E454A1A)
Actually if you watch all the logos pop up in the beginning of the episode they have some awesome potentials for shirts. The Pirate one with death would be cool, or even the Action Johnny shirt would do, but the Triad is some of my favorite characters so I would still like to see a Triad shirt.
- by The Amazing Nick
- (unregistered id: F78A83AE75)
IT's true not all the shirts were great.
The first was pimp, hands down.
The second, while small, was still great (I think it'd would've gotten more brownie points if it had greay buttons drawn on it like Killinger's suit)
The Third was lacking, but the purple change was very welcome
The Fourth....yeah, it sucked.
I don't see what's wrong with Rusty's day Camp. I bought one immediately
The first was pimp, hands down.
The second, while small, was still great (I think it'd would've gotten more brownie points if it had greay buttons drawn on it like Killinger's suit)
The Third was lacking, but the purple change was very welcome
The Fourth....yeah, it sucked.
I don't see what's wrong with Rusty's day Camp. I bought one immediately
- by Ticking-Glock
- (unregistered id: 83635DCD3E)
More Johnny Quest References (With Johnny Quest!!)
I didn't really watch a lot of Johnny Quest as a kid. Is Dr. Z supposed to be a reference to Dr. Zin?
Also, Johnny trying to rescue Dean? Great!
I almost have to feel guilty to think that new Dr. Mrs. The Monarch costume is hot..but geez, they went all Jessica Rabbit redoing her character design.
It does seem like they're at least trying to play to the whole "Brock's somebody's daddy" line that's been going on since season two. The logical conclusion would be that he's Dermitt's father, but they could always just be tugging our chain at this point.
So far there seems to be a lot more set-up in these early season episodes than there is humor. I don't mind, I mean, I miss the humor, but I'm still in love with the show.
And, totally unrelated to this episode: Does anyone else want to see if King Gorilla makes it into this season? He and the tiger guy (and the guy who looks like a scab) were the only jailed supervillains friends of The Monarch that haven't been killed yet.
I didn't really watch a lot of Johnny Quest as a kid. Is Dr. Z supposed to be a reference to Dr. Zin?
Also, Johnny trying to rescue Dean? Great!
I almost have to feel guilty to think that new Dr. Mrs. The Monarch costume is hot..but geez, they went all Jessica Rabbit redoing her character design.
It does seem like they're at least trying to play to the whole "Brock's somebody's daddy" line that's been going on since season two. The logical conclusion would be that he's Dermitt's father, but they could always just be tugging our chain at this point.
So far there seems to be a lot more set-up in these early season episodes than there is humor. I don't mind, I mean, I miss the humor, but I'm still in love with the show.
And, totally unrelated to this episode: Does anyone else want to see if King Gorilla makes it into this season? He and the tiger guy (and the guy who looks like a scab) were the only jailed supervillains friends of The Monarch that haven't been killed yet.
- by Roscoe
- (unregistered id: BD83BFB0C7)
Billy's a Virgin......He reluctantly admitted it in Escape to the house of mummies (part 2) Also, the reason Dermit's voice sounds like Billy's is because they are both voiced by DOC HAMMER. Doc even admits on the Season 2 Commentary he is a horible voice actor because all his characters are just his voice Pitched up or down. The kid sounded like Dr. Mrs. Monarch too, that doesn't mean he was hers.
My money is on the obvious choice, lets look at what we know:
-Unlike Billy, Brock has presumably had countless sexual conquests, which could have Easily lead to un unwanted/unknown pregnancy
-The kid was driving Brock crazy for some, unexplicable reason, (probably brock saw something about himself he recognized in the kid.
-Dermit had long blonde hair,
-He said his dad was Black-ops,
-Also, there was the not-so-subtle clue of Doc telling Brock to wait to pass judgement 'till HE had kids.
For all these reasons it seems pretty clear to me whose kid he is.
My money is on the obvious choice, lets look at what we know:
-Unlike Billy, Brock has presumably had countless sexual conquests, which could have Easily lead to un unwanted/unknown pregnancy
-The kid was driving Brock crazy for some, unexplicable reason, (probably brock saw something about himself he recognized in the kid.
-Dermit had long blonde hair,
-He said his dad was Black-ops,
-Also, there was the not-so-subtle clue of Doc telling Brock to wait to pass judgement 'till HE had kids.
For all these reasons it seems pretty clear to me whose kid he is.
- by warjoski
- (unregistered id: A70938E3C5)
Sorry, but I gotta disagree. Billy had amnesia for years. He may not know if he slept with someone. Also, Dermit probably wouldn't know much about his dad. Might be making up the Black Ops stuff as wish fulfillment. Both characters being voiced by Doc Hammer might be because they are supposed to be related or just to cut down on $ spent on voice actors. Dermit also shot Billy. That might mean something. And I agree with what someone else said farther down the chain: they were just making Brock too obvious a choice. It might not be Billy, though I think he's the best bet, but I don't think it's Brock.
- by Pirate Hippy
- (unregistered id: CA31821874)
Apart from shooting Billy (Dermit is probably a lousy shot like he is a lousy fighter: all talk, no substance) Dermit had ZERO interaction with Billy; he had lots of interaction with Brock. It is extremely clear from their conversation in the car that his mother sent Dermit to the day camp specifically to meet his father. Dermit made it a point to interact with Brock, and not with Billy or with any other adult.
The entire episode is about fatherhood. Notice Rusty telling Brock that he doesn't understand fatherhood; notice Orpheus telling Brock pretty much the same thing. Notice how easily Dermit pushes Brock's buttons (as a child would do to a parent). Notice how Dermit is precisely the kind of child Brock would not want (disappointed father syndrome). Notice how Dermit is big and blond and looks a bit like Brock.
How much clearer could it be? If this is a huge fake out, then that's terrible writing. One or two false clues are sometimes excusable, but not this many. If it isn't Brock then there's either something very obvious we are all missing, or Jackson Publick and Doc Hammer are getting really lazy.
The entire episode is about fatherhood. Notice Rusty telling Brock that he doesn't understand fatherhood; notice Orpheus telling Brock pretty much the same thing. Notice how easily Dermit pushes Brock's buttons (as a child would do to a parent). Notice how Dermit is precisely the kind of child Brock would not want (disappointed father syndrome). Notice how Dermit is big and blond and looks a bit like Brock.
How much clearer could it be? If this is a huge fake out, then that's terrible writing. One or two false clues are sometimes excusable, but not this many. If it isn't Brock then there's either something very obvious we are all missing, or Jackson Publick and Doc Hammer are getting really lazy.
- by Pirate Hippy
- (unregistered id: CA31821874)
Yes I know Dermott briefly mocks Rusty on the tour train/cart, but it does not faze Rusty in the slightest and Dermott makes no further attempt to talk with Rusty. He talks to absolutely no other adults at all, apart from Rusty and Brock. His mother sent him there to meet his father; we see Brock and Dermott conversing at least twice, including the polaroid of a happy Brock "consoling" Dermott. What else are we supposed to think? False clues are supposed to be a lot more subtle than this, people. Get a grip.
- by Pirate Hippy
- (unregistered id: CA31821874)
Not my writing but all valid points:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dermott_Fictel
***At the end of the episode "The Buddy System", Dermott's mother comes by with a car to pick him up. Dermott and his mother seem to have agreed to come to the camp for the sole purpose of meeting his possible father, and perhaps suggests Dermott has suffered emotionally as a result of not seeing his father, which is evident in his aggressive attitude toward Brock (accusing him of "walking away" when Brock turned around to avoid a confrontation).
Dermott himself mentions in passing that, at least he has been lead to believe, his father was "some Black Ops special agent", which could possibly be describing Brock's past service in the OSI.
In addition, when Brock was calming down Dr. Venture after his outburst at Hank, Dr. Venture told him, "just wait until you have kids of your own," possibly foreshadowing that the reason Dermott is able to get under Brock's skin so easily is that he is his son.
Brock is seemingly oblivious to having fathered any children, and as such is unaware of his possible relation to Dermott; throughout the episode, he is trying to come up with ways to retaliate against Dermott's disrespectful attitude without actually coming to blows with him, as his code of ethics prevents him from harming children. Dermott's provocations may have been a way to "test" Brock, however, as he and his mother have the following exchange when he is picked up from the Venture Compound:
"Dermott's mother: Dermott sweetie, did you meet him?"
"Dermott: Yeah, he was okay. You sure he's my real father?"
Despite their rough treatment of one another, Dermott, a rebellious boy himself, may take pride in knowing that his supposed father is a big, muscular tough guy. Even so, there's a possibility that Dermott could have been talking about another adult at the camp, i.e. Sgt. Hatred.***
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dermott_Fictel
***At the end of the episode "The Buddy System", Dermott's mother comes by with a car to pick him up. Dermott and his mother seem to have agreed to come to the camp for the sole purpose of meeting his possible father, and perhaps suggests Dermott has suffered emotionally as a result of not seeing his father, which is evident in his aggressive attitude toward Brock (accusing him of "walking away" when Brock turned around to avoid a confrontation).
Dermott himself mentions in passing that, at least he has been lead to believe, his father was "some Black Ops special agent", which could possibly be describing Brock's past service in the OSI.
In addition, when Brock was calming down Dr. Venture after his outburst at Hank, Dr. Venture told him, "just wait until you have kids of your own," possibly foreshadowing that the reason Dermott is able to get under Brock's skin so easily is that he is his son.
Brock is seemingly oblivious to having fathered any children, and as such is unaware of his possible relation to Dermott; throughout the episode, he is trying to come up with ways to retaliate against Dermott's disrespectful attitude without actually coming to blows with him, as his code of ethics prevents him from harming children. Dermott's provocations may have been a way to "test" Brock, however, as he and his mother have the following exchange when he is picked up from the Venture Compound:
"Dermott's mother: Dermott sweetie, did you meet him?"
"Dermott: Yeah, he was okay. You sure he's my real father?"
Despite their rough treatment of one another, Dermott, a rebellious boy himself, may take pride in knowing that his supposed father is a big, muscular tough guy. Even so, there's a possibility that Dermott could have been talking about another adult at the camp, i.e. Sgt. Hatred.***
- by DeimosMasque
- (unregistered id: DD74F4CF47)
"Dermott: Yeah, he was okay. You sure he's my real father?"
See that's the line that makes me think Brock ISN'T his real father and Dr. Venture is. For a kid who thinks he's a bad ass but really just Dave Matthews, and thinks his dad is a Black Ops agent, Dr. Venture is the biggest let down for his "Real Father" ever.
See that's the line that makes me think Brock ISN'T his real father and Dr. Venture is. For a kid who thinks he's a bad ass but really just Dave Matthews, and thinks his dad is a Black Ops agent, Dr. Venture is the biggest let down for his "Real Father" ever.
- by hank
- (unregistered id: B4B4ADC2E7)
that "yeah he was okay" threw me too. but think about it - a dave-matthews esque wanna-be-tough-guy would never show his real feelings. it would have been completely out of character for him to say
"thats him!!? HOLY WHAT A BAD ASS"
passiveness is a pretty big staple of the wanna-be-tough crowd.
"thats him!!? HOLY WHAT A BAD ASS"
passiveness is a pretty big staple of the wanna-be-tough crowd.
- by Pirate Hippy
- (unregistered id: CA31821874)
While the Dr. Venture as Dermott's father theory is less silly than some of the other theories (ie Billy, Hank, etc as the father), it still is unlikely.
Dermott has grown up without his father. He's going to have a lot of issues with his real father for not being there for him. Don't expect him to heap praises on him, even if he were (like Brock) "god-like".
Besides, Dermott is your typical punk-ass teenager who mocks and denigrates EVERYTHING and EVERYONE. If he says about his real father "yeah, he was okay", that's high praise indeed, coming from that source.
Context is everything.
Dermott has grown up without his father. He's going to have a lot of issues with his real father for not being there for him. Don't expect him to heap praises on him, even if he were (like Brock) "god-like".
Besides, Dermott is your typical punk-ass teenager who mocks and denigrates EVERYTHING and EVERYONE. If he says about his real father "yeah, he was okay", that's high praise indeed, coming from that source.
Context is everything.
- by hank
- (unregistered id: 992BA4FF2B)
thank you for expanding on my point - i forgot the teenager aspect.
again, context is everything. if nothing else dh&jp have shown that they know this. who else in the venture universe could have dropped the line: "if you didn't look like a suicidegirl" or w/e it is. still mentioning suicidegirls? classic.
again, context is everything. if nothing else dh&jp have shown that they know this. who else in the venture universe could have dropped the line: "if you didn't look like a suicidegirl" or w/e it is. still mentioning suicidegirls? classic.
- by warjoski
- (unregistered id: A70938E3C5)
I'm not sure I understand why it would be lazy writing. Most mystery stories are loaded with red herrings and false clues. And it's not like they haven't used devices like that before. As to your point about Dermott briefly mocking Dr. Venture, he really only briefly mocks Brock too, doesn't he? He mocks him at the judo demonstration. I can't think of when else he seeks Brock out. Brock actually seeks him out for revenge. The picture occurs after Brock watches Dean smack Dermott up. Nothing about that really indicates to me that Dermott is giving Brock any special attention.
Maybe it's Billy. Maybe it's Brock. In any case, I don't think it's all that clear. The writers of this show like to twist things. I don't think the situation is as obvious as you are implying it is.
Maybe it's Billy. Maybe it's Brock. In any case, I don't think it's all that clear. The writers of this show like to twist things. I don't think the situation is as obvious as you are implying it is.
- by Pirate Hippy
- (unregistered id: CA31821874)
I can only shake my head at comments like yours. It's obvious why JP and DH are writers, and you are not.
"I'm not sure I understand why it would be lazy writing."
Because lazy writers give you a whole bunch of false clues, and no/few correct clues, and count on their "surprise" carrying the story. That's lazy writing. Better writers have an interlocking pattern of clues that hang together as a story and keep the red herrings to a minimum.
There are a lot of incredibly bad and LAZY mystery writers - and please note not only are JP and DH not bad or lazy writers, they don't write mystery novels or mystery stories, either. They write comedy and satire. Any resemblance to mystery writing on their part is strictly accidental or for the purposes of parody.
Nowhere have JP and DH completely pulled crap out of nowhere while throwing a boatload of false clues at us to try to trick us into jumping to the wrong conclusion. There have been a few minor false clues, but they have never been part of a larger interlocking pattern of complimentary clues, they were always stand alone throwaway lines, like Billy's ridiculous baboon uterus rumor mongering.
"Maybe it's Billy. Maybe it's Brock. In any case, I don't think it's all that clear."
If you don't think it's clear, I really have to wonder what show you think you've been watching. How much clearer does it have to be before it gets through to you?
Could it be a surprise and be someone besides Brock? Sure - but it WOULD be a surprise, because ALL of the evidence points to Brock, ie, it's pretty f_cking clear to anyone who is paying attention. If it's not Brock, it's precisely a surprise because it is pretty clear from this episode that it is supposed to be Brock - that's what we're MEANT to think.
You can't have it both ways - if it isn't clear it's Brock, then there's no way you can argue "it can't be Brock because it is too obvious". If on the other hand "it can't be Brock because it is too obvious", than it IS clear it is Brock based on the evidence from this episode, which JP and DH are going to entirely ignore/subvert in future episodes, ie you're arguing that JP and DH are going to go against their past inclinations and completely bullshit us on a major plot element.
But it can't be both "unclear" and a "surprise" at the same time. If it's clear it's Brock, it will be a surprise if it is not him. It it's not clear it's Brock, then none of our conversation so far makes any sense.
In the past, JP and DH's surprises have never been directly contrary to all the evidence they have given us prior to the revelation. That's what's going to have to happen if it turns out to be someone besides Brock. It could happen - but JP and DH are going to have to pull one mighty big rabbit out of a hat in order to make it work.
"I'm not sure I understand why it would be lazy writing."
Because lazy writers give you a whole bunch of false clues, and no/few correct clues, and count on their "surprise" carrying the story. That's lazy writing. Better writers have an interlocking pattern of clues that hang together as a story and keep the red herrings to a minimum.
There are a lot of incredibly bad and LAZY mystery writers - and please note not only are JP and DH not bad or lazy writers, they don't write mystery novels or mystery stories, either. They write comedy and satire. Any resemblance to mystery writing on their part is strictly accidental or for the purposes of parody.
Nowhere have JP and DH completely pulled crap out of nowhere while throwing a boatload of false clues at us to try to trick us into jumping to the wrong conclusion. There have been a few minor false clues, but they have never been part of a larger interlocking pattern of complimentary clues, they were always stand alone throwaway lines, like Billy's ridiculous baboon uterus rumor mongering.
"Maybe it's Billy. Maybe it's Brock. In any case, I don't think it's all that clear."
If you don't think it's clear, I really have to wonder what show you think you've been watching. How much clearer does it have to be before it gets through to you?
Could it be a surprise and be someone besides Brock? Sure - but it WOULD be a surprise, because ALL of the evidence points to Brock, ie, it's pretty f_cking clear to anyone who is paying attention. If it's not Brock, it's precisely a surprise because it is pretty clear from this episode that it is supposed to be Brock - that's what we're MEANT to think.
You can't have it both ways - if it isn't clear it's Brock, then there's no way you can argue "it can't be Brock because it is too obvious". If on the other hand "it can't be Brock because it is too obvious", than it IS clear it is Brock based on the evidence from this episode, which JP and DH are going to entirely ignore/subvert in future episodes, ie you're arguing that JP and DH are going to go against their past inclinations and completely bullshit us on a major plot element.
But it can't be both "unclear" and a "surprise" at the same time. If it's clear it's Brock, it will be a surprise if it is not him. It it's not clear it's Brock, then none of our conversation so far makes any sense.
In the past, JP and DH's surprises have never been directly contrary to all the evidence they have given us prior to the revelation. That's what's going to have to happen if it turns out to be someone besides Brock. It could happen - but JP and DH are going to have to pull one mighty big rabbit out of a hat in order to make it work.
- by Will
- (unregistered id: 862A6B5101)
Dermott also stares at Brock as he's riding away on that little tour bus or whatever it's called after the Judo demonstration. It would be weird if his father, Dr. Venture was at the front of the bus (That's what I'm calling it for now) and he ignored him to continue looking at some random guy.
I think it's much more likely that he's letting his gaze linger while he's soaking in and contemplating his first interaction with his father.
I think it's much more likely that he's letting his gaze linger while he's soaking in and contemplating his first interaction with his father.
- by Amaziah Nazarian
- (unregistered id: 47565C883D)
I totally loved this episode! Seeing the venture compound grounds is always fun and this episode had tons of characters. There is some things I noticed that might be fun to share.
1. If that kid (Durmit?) is really Brock's son, I'd bet there will be a problem with the fact that he uses guns.
2. Jefferson!
3. It looked like some of Hatreds men were wearing jet packs but I don't think they look like the ones 21 stole from the monarchs storage in season 2, Hatred must of upgraded design.
4. I also transcribed the text at the bottom of the screen at the beginning of the first act, in case you cannot read it on the internet video...
Camp size has been estimated based on survey conducted in 1978. All camps created after cited survey have not been taken into consideration, Rusty's Day Camp is a privately owned camp. Therefore any and all children residing on the premises are to be considered trespassers. Rusty's Day Camp holds the right to prosecute any or all trespassers that do not uphold the rules and regulations stipulated in the supplied document entitled "I'm a good day camper"
Now you don't have to squint your eyes!
Ready, set, ... roshambo!
1. If that kid (Durmit?) is really Brock's son, I'd bet there will be a problem with the fact that he uses guns.
2. Jefferson!
3. It looked like some of Hatreds men were wearing jet packs but I don't think they look like the ones 21 stole from the monarchs storage in season 2, Hatred must of upgraded design.
4. I also transcribed the text at the bottom of the screen at the beginning of the first act, in case you cannot read it on the internet video...
Camp size has been estimated based on survey conducted in 1978. All camps created after cited survey have not been taken into consideration, Rusty's Day Camp is a privately owned camp. Therefore any and all children residing on the premises are to be considered trespassers. Rusty's Day Camp holds the right to prosecute any or all trespassers that do not uphold the rules and regulations stipulated in the supplied document entitled "I'm a good day camper"
Now you don't have to squint your eyes!
Ready, set, ... roshambo!
- by dru26
- (unregistered id: F74CE08F0A)
- by green_lantren_mogo
- (unregistered id: 9AB51F9CA8)
This has to be my faviorite episode of the series now!
Some hilghlights...
Dean pummling dermitt(and imprssing triana)
The revelation brock is dermitts father
Rusty cloning the kid
The pirate's lecture on the rubber mask set
The monarchs spying/arching
Action johnny
Everything cuvasfan mentioned already
Some hilghlights...
Dean pummling dermitt(and imprssing triana)
The revelation brock is dermitts father
Rusty cloning the kid
The pirate's lecture on the rubber mask set
The monarchs spying/arching
Action johnny
Everything cuvasfan mentioned already
- by pulsar5271
- (unregistered id: DA55D7068E)
Yeah, Dermitt's gotta be Brock's son. Who else? It just fits; he and Hank hit it off immediately, just like Brock and Hank. Plus it's a well-documented fact that Brock has sown plenty of wild oats.
And the mother in the car had a Scottish (or Irish?) accent, so it's unlikely that it's Myra. Though I guess that could be explained away on account of the crazy...
And the mother in the car had a Scottish (or Irish?) accent, so it's unlikely that it's Myra. Though I guess that could be explained away on account of the crazy...
- by someguyon the internet
- (unregistered id: 72D1B28CF8)
They seem to be telegraphing this whole Brock is Dermit's father thing a bit too much. Methinks they're throwing us a curveball, and Doc Venture is the boy's father. He had mentioned in "Past Tense" yjat he didn't lose his cherry until he was 24 or 26 (I can't remember) making Dermit roughly the right age.
- by BFunk
- (unregistered id: C0427C099F)
That would be awfully tricky of them to pull a fast one on us and have him not be Brock's son, but come on. He's got to be. The kid's huge, he has a much greater resemblance to Brock than to Doc, and he was particularly hostile towards Brock.
Meanwhile, Brock's been with tons of women, and they probably weren't all supermodels. Remember Lt. Baldovich? Plus this woman would probably be in her forties by now, so there's no reason to believe she'd still be gorgeous...if she ever was.
My money's on it being Leslie Cohen.
Meanwhile, Brock's been with tons of women, and they probably weren't all supermodels. Remember Lt. Baldovich? Plus this woman would probably be in her forties by now, so there's no reason to believe she'd still be gorgeous...if she ever was.
My money's on it being Leslie Cohen.
- by Pirate Hippy
- (unregistered id: CA31821874)
Well, you could prove anything with that "logic" of yours. Just claim it's opposite day, or you've taken a trip to Bizarro Venture Brothers.
Apart from shooting Billy (Dermott is probably a lousy shot like he is a lousy fighter: all talk, no substance) Dermott had ZERO interaction with Billy; he had lots of interaction with Brock. It is extremely clear from their conversation in the car that his mother sent Dermott to the day camp specifically to meet his father. Dermott made it a point to interact with Brock, and not with Billy or Johnny or most of the other adults (he does mock Rusty but Rusty isn't fazed in the slightest - unlike Brock).
The entire episode is about fatherhood. Notice Rusty telling Brock that he doesn't understand fatherhood; notice Orpheus telling Brock pretty much the same thing. Notice how easily Dermott pushes Brock's buttons (as a child would do to a parent). Notice how Dermott is precisely the kind of child Brock would not want (disappointed father syndrome). Notice how Dermott is big and blond and looks a bit like Brock.
How much clearer could it be? If this is a huge fake out, then that's terrible writing. One or two false clues are sometimes excusable, but not this many. If it isn't Brock then there's either something very obvious we are all missing (including you "it isn't Brock" people), or else Jackson Publick and Doc Hammer are getting really lazy. They haven't done something like that yet.
Apart from shooting Billy (Dermott is probably a lousy shot like he is a lousy fighter: all talk, no substance) Dermott had ZERO interaction with Billy; he had lots of interaction with Brock. It is extremely clear from their conversation in the car that his mother sent Dermott to the day camp specifically to meet his father. Dermott made it a point to interact with Brock, and not with Billy or Johnny or most of the other adults (he does mock Rusty but Rusty isn't fazed in the slightest - unlike Brock).
The entire episode is about fatherhood. Notice Rusty telling Brock that he doesn't understand fatherhood; notice Orpheus telling Brock pretty much the same thing. Notice how easily Dermott pushes Brock's buttons (as a child would do to a parent). Notice how Dermott is precisely the kind of child Brock would not want (disappointed father syndrome). Notice how Dermott is big and blond and looks a bit like Brock.
How much clearer could it be? If this is a huge fake out, then that's terrible writing. One or two false clues are sometimes excusable, but not this many. If it isn't Brock then there's either something very obvious we are all missing (including you "it isn't Brock" people), or else Jackson Publick and Doc Hammer are getting really lazy. They haven't done something like that yet.
- by Pirate Hippy
- (unregistered id: CA31821874)
Check out promo for next week's episode they are showing on Adult Swim; scene of Rusty getting it on with some red headed woman in a tent and he mentions something about not having sex (or not having sex with this woman - not clear to me) in about 19 years. More revelations to come, it seems.
- by Pirate Hippy
- (unregistered id: CA31821874)
Rusty does say or imply that his first sex was with someone really ugly "you didn't see her, it (she?) was horrific". The young Myra isn't ugly at all. The red headed woman in the new promo about to have sex with Rusty isn't bad looking either. The only bad looking woman is the mannish looking woman who says "how's it hanging?" to Brock in one of the older promos. It's possible Rusty had sex with several women when he was 24, and that it was only the first one who was "horrific". Hmmm...
- by Da7e
- (unregistered id: 90EE92AB4C)
- by Da7e
- (unregistered id: 90EE92AB4C)
- by Pirate Hippy
- (unregistered id: CA31821874)
Dermott's mother speaking in the car sounded a bit like an Australian accent to me, not Scottish or Irish. But she definitely did not sound like Myra.
Nor did she sound (I think - my memory could be bad here) like the mannish looking woman in the Dr. Qymn (sp?) Medicine Woman promo who says "how's it hanging?" to Brock, nor did she sound like the red headed woman that Rusty is about to have sex with in the latest promo for that very same episode (if I'm right - they are both set in tents in what could be the Australian outback or somewhere else far away in the wilds).
Hmmm....too many mystery women's voices to keep track of. I guess we will just have to wait until Friday. Or maybe even longer.
Nor did she sound (I think - my memory could be bad here) like the mannish looking woman in the Dr. Qymn (sp?) Medicine Woman promo who says "how's it hanging?" to Brock, nor did she sound like the red headed woman that Rusty is about to have sex with in the latest promo for that very same episode (if I'm right - they are both set in tents in what could be the Australian outback or somewhere else far away in the wilds).
Hmmm....too many mystery women's voices to keep track of. I guess we will just have to wait until Friday. Or maybe even longer.
- by Dylan
- (unregistered id: 6FA78A1379)
- by jon
- (unregistered id: 6DF3208785)
ya I noticed that too
I thought it was a mistake or a mis-naming but the info paragraph describes the show correctly so maybe "Enter the Bad Seed" is the final choice on the name? IDK
just wanna say, by the way, I was so satisfied when that Dermitt kid got the shit knocked out of him. I fucking hate people like him. And when Triana was totally calling him out on being so "Dave Matthews;" genius.
I thought it was a mistake or a mis-naming but the info paragraph describes the show correctly so maybe "Enter the Bad Seed" is the final choice on the name? IDK
just wanna say, by the way, I was so satisfied when that Dermitt kid got the shit knocked out of him. I fucking hate people like him. And when Triana was totally calling him out on being so "Dave Matthews;" genius.
- by BlueInfinite
- (unregistered id: 407B4FC502)
- by Roscoe
- (unregistered id: BD83BFB0C7)
HA! I thought that too!
Then I decided maybe it was somthing [He] and Dr.Venture came to an agreement upon when they became.....uh, Arch-er and Arched? Anyway I like the thought of Sgt. Hatered Using Military time at there "Meet-n-greet" and Doc lashing out at him for being pretentious, or something.
Anyway, yeah. It bugged me too.
Then I decided maybe it was somthing [He] and Dr.Venture came to an agreement upon when they became.....uh, Arch-er and Arched? Anyway I like the thought of Sgt. Hatered Using Military time at there "Meet-n-greet" and Doc lashing out at him for being pretentious, or something.
Anyway, yeah. It bugged me too.
- by cgeye
- (unregistered id: AE6769E556)
I thought it was deliberate, myself.
Check it. If a sex offender (on the outside, as rehabilitated as a death threat from the Guild can make him) knows that his archenemy has an annual child day camp, and he has that arch's schedule in advance, *and* he's so detail-oriented he makes the arch fill out a sensitivities worksheet, prior to their contract.
*And* Dr. Zin, one of his faves, would be stopping by, if Johnny's around....*wouldn't* the Sarge know when to drop in by accident -- and to stage a confusion over using non-military time, as an excuse?
For the Sarge, he sees his former victims, new kids, an admired arching inspiration, and squeezes in some arching practice. For him, it's all good....
Check it. If a sex offender (on the outside, as rehabilitated as a death threat from the Guild can make him) knows that his archenemy has an annual child day camp, and he has that arch's schedule in advance, *and* he's so detail-oriented he makes the arch fill out a sensitivities worksheet, prior to their contract.
*And* Dr. Zin, one of his faves, would be stopping by, if Johnny's around....*wouldn't* the Sarge know when to drop in by accident -- and to stage a confusion over using non-military time, as an excuse?
For the Sarge, he sees his former victims, new kids, an admired arching inspiration, and squeezes in some arching practice. For him, it's all good....
- by cgeye
- (unregistered id: 3B90826AD8)
I know it started out as a throwaway joke, then got momentum during the wedding. It's a handy meme -- look, these guys are so unprotected and naif-like that they can't even protect themselves from a villain who Went Too Far.
But that villain now is the main evil character for this season, and he's in contact with his two victims each and every episode. For a man who has a court order restricting his contact with children, it's funny he got permission (from the Guild, if not the ineffectual justice system) to arch the father of the two people we know he harmed.
But he was a villain when he did it; the brothers recognized him in costume. He was a villain even when Brock was trying the prove the Guild existed, and when the brothers were infants. Didn't Rusty's Law apply to child molestation? Wouldn't that be a prime reason for the law to be enforced?
How did the molestation happen?
If Sgt. Hatred was actively henching back then, why was he poaching on the Monarch's man? Doesn't the Guild severely prosecute a villain who goes off assignment? Hell, the Monarch almost got iced for arching Dr. Venture before he got Guild sanction, before he even stopped being a henchman for Phantom Limb. The way the Monarch has reacted to his deposing, it's as if he has never arched anyone else. So, how did Sgt. Hatred get close to the kids, with or without Guild sanction?
How did the molestation happen?
And the boys speak openly of the bad man; either Hatred was on the compound premises, or he took them somewhere else. There is nowhere Brock Samson wouldn't go to save to save those kids, and he'd ask them what happened.
Sgt. Hatred is a known child molester.
He molested Brock's boys.
Why isn't he dead?
How did the molestation...
Why isn't he dead because he closed down the OSI investigation into the Guild, and thereby became a traitor to the unit? It's not like that Big H hides anything...
Like, man, how?
All I know is that if anyone would be dead by now in the Venture universe, it would be a man who betrayed Brock Samson, then openly raped his charges, without any meaningful penalty. And this man now has the right to bother -- molest -- his entire family, as part of an agreement with a nest of villains Samson spent years trying to flush out and destroy.
Sargeant Hatred is the luckiest fucking man on the face of the Earth. But for how long?
But that villain now is the main evil character for this season, and he's in contact with his two victims each and every episode. For a man who has a court order restricting his contact with children, it's funny he got permission (from the Guild, if not the ineffectual justice system) to arch the father of the two people we know he harmed.
But he was a villain when he did it; the brothers recognized him in costume. He was a villain even when Brock was trying the prove the Guild existed, and when the brothers were infants. Didn't Rusty's Law apply to child molestation? Wouldn't that be a prime reason for the law to be enforced?
How did the molestation happen?
If Sgt. Hatred was actively henching back then, why was he poaching on the Monarch's man? Doesn't the Guild severely prosecute a villain who goes off assignment? Hell, the Monarch almost got iced for arching Dr. Venture before he got Guild sanction, before he even stopped being a henchman for Phantom Limb. The way the Monarch has reacted to his deposing, it's as if he has never arched anyone else. So, how did Sgt. Hatred get close to the kids, with or without Guild sanction?
How did the molestation happen?
And the boys speak openly of the bad man; either Hatred was on the compound premises, or he took them somewhere else. There is nowhere Brock Samson wouldn't go to save to save those kids, and he'd ask them what happened.
Sgt. Hatred is a known child molester.
He molested Brock's boys.
Why isn't he dead?
How did the molestation...
Why isn't he dead because he closed down the OSI investigation into the Guild, and thereby became a traitor to the unit? It's not like that Big H hides anything...
Like, man, how?
All I know is that if anyone would be dead by now in the Venture universe, it would be a man who betrayed Brock Samson, then openly raped his charges, without any meaningful penalty. And this man now has the right to bother -- molest -- his entire family, as part of an agreement with a nest of villains Samson spent years trying to flush out and destroy.
Sargeant Hatred is the luckiest fucking man on the face of the Earth. But for how long?
- by Pirate Hippy
- (unregistered id: CA31821874)
Careful there, you don't want to use the word "meme" here. Some anonymous internet user will snicker at you.
I'm pretty sure there's way too much back story for most of your questions to ever get answered fully. It's pretty clear that the Venture Brothers are constantly getting into jams or being kidnapped (or killed and cloned). There's so much wackiness going on that we are probably only seeing one tenth of it all. That was one of the points of the Escape to the House of Mummies Part II episode. Don't sweat it, we'll probably never know the full story and we probably are not meant to know.
I'm pretty sure there's way too much back story for most of your questions to ever get answered fully. It's pretty clear that the Venture Brothers are constantly getting into jams or being kidnapped (or killed and cloned). There's so much wackiness going on that we are probably only seeing one tenth of it all. That was one of the points of the Escape to the House of Mummies Part II episode. Don't sweat it, we'll probably never know the full story and we probably are not meant to know.
- by CaptainGS
- (unregistered id: B5BA42DF52)
In point of fact, I'm just playfully poking fun at a fellow fan of a show I happen to very much enjoy.
I know what memes are, sir. But I find it amusing and pretentious when words like 'meme' and 'trope' and 'gravitas' are used with the utmost seriousness in a discussion of a cartoon. It reeks of someone taking themselves *way* too seriously, and aiming to impress.
You know what else characterizes the exact same thing? An over-zealous tendency to get all uppity and defensive.
To that extent, I'd say we're evenly matched.
I know what memes are, sir. But I find it amusing and pretentious when words like 'meme' and 'trope' and 'gravitas' are used with the utmost seriousness in a discussion of a cartoon. It reeks of someone taking themselves *way* too seriously, and aiming to impress.
You know what else characterizes the exact same thing? An over-zealous tendency to get all uppity and defensive.
To that extent, I'd say we're evenly matched.
- by cgeye
- (unregistered id: 0499F4AD4E)
Did I ever post in a way previously that gave you permission to make fun of me?
Have we ever been formally introduced, so you'd know whether you were on safe ground, to make fun of me? You wouldn't do that to Brock Samson, now would you? You'd be *nice*. Don't be a Dermott Fictel to the Internets.... I hope your mother raised you better than that.
Did you even think that taking this show that seriously was a way of performing an homage to the super-science faux gravitas AstroBase GO! serves up for us, every blessed week VB is on?
And am I a fucking *clown* to you? Am I?
Lastly, were you brave enough not to substitute someone else's contact information for your own, on a public board, and not fit in yanking one more person's chain?
Have we ever been formally introduced, so you'd know whether you were on safe ground, to make fun of me? You wouldn't do that to Brock Samson, now would you? You'd be *nice*. Don't be a Dermott Fictel to the Internets.... I hope your mother raised you better than that.
Did you even think that taking this show that seriously was a way of performing an homage to the super-science faux gravitas AstroBase GO! serves up for us, every blessed week VB is on?
And am I a fucking *clown* to you? Am I?
Lastly, were you brave enough not to substitute someone else's contact information for your own, on a public board, and not fit in yanking one more person's chain?
- by That Guy! From the Internet!
- (unregistered id: B2886A6CAD)
Re: arching.
Maybe "arching" has specific connotations within the Guild? Like, your arch is your primary rival, but not necessarily your sole rival. So even though the Monarch was Dr. Venture's arch, it wouldn't mean that Sgt. Hatred or Baron Werner Underbheit couldn't occasionally attack him, just that they couldn't focus all their attention on him?
But arching aside, we know the Guild doesn't look kindly on unwanted sexual advances, so Hatred should've been punished by the Guild as well as from the courts.
Maybe the Guild looked the other way since Hatred has been an important member for so long? The guy did infiltrate OSI, after all.
Maybe "arching" has specific connotations within the Guild? Like, your arch is your primary rival, but not necessarily your sole rival. So even though the Monarch was Dr. Venture's arch, it wouldn't mean that Sgt. Hatred or Baron Werner Underbheit couldn't occasionally attack him, just that they couldn't focus all their attention on him?
But arching aside, we know the Guild doesn't look kindly on unwanted sexual advances, so Hatred should've been punished by the Guild as well as from the courts.
Maybe the Guild looked the other way since Hatred has been an important member for so long? The guy did infiltrate OSI, after all.
- by Bonzo the Fifth
- (unregistered id: 8C55CB498F)
Wow... What an episode...
Man, I'm still reeling from Dean's spinning murder top of sissyifed anger. That so didn't go the way I thought it was, but it was worth it just to see Triana's reaction to it...
And Dr. Mrs. The Monarch's costume...
Whoa... That's totally going to generate some fetish fuel at the next costume con....
Sgt. Hatred continues to thoroughly creep out... and the Dr. Zin cameo... complete with classic leitmotif... priceless...
I do wonder if they'll find Billy's hand, though... The longer this season goes on, the more of a buttmonkey the poor guy's becoming... I hope they're going to give him something to make up for it by the end of the season...
Man, I'm still reeling from Dean's spinning murder top of sissyifed anger. That so didn't go the way I thought it was, but it was worth it just to see Triana's reaction to it...
And Dr. Mrs. The Monarch's costume...
Whoa... That's totally going to generate some fetish fuel at the next costume con....
Sgt. Hatred continues to thoroughly creep out... and the Dr. Zin cameo... complete with classic leitmotif... priceless...
I do wonder if they'll find Billy's hand, though... The longer this season goes on, the more of a buttmonkey the poor guy's becoming... I hope they're going to give him something to make up for it by the end of the season...
- by BIGMAMAFREAK
- (unregistered id: 180DB3087A)
I agree....POOR BILLY! They gotta get him laid this season or let him win the lottery or something. His life is soooo pathetic and he's so sweet and loyal to DR. VENTURE. I just can't stand see him take another beating or mutilation. Seems his whole life has been one disapointment after another....c'mon guys, throw the lil' dude a bone!
SHEILA's new outfit is fantabulous, not that she wasn't eye-poppingly fashionable in the past. Now I officially have a hot girl-crush on a cartoon character!!! What else is next?
DEAN manning up (even in his sissified way ,with the tears of rage streaming down his face) defending his love, TRIANA, was a high point of the season so far. I adore that even before his "macho" display, young MS. ORPHEUS was playfully flirting with him a bit.
The fact that the VENTURE brothers have never "seen another teen--ager before" accounts for their all-encompassing dorkiness. They're not socialized in the least...probably learned most of their behaviors from TV and movies (decades worth of corniness and outdated presentations of teen interactions on reruns since the inception of "talkies"). Never gave this much thought before....just got a little annoyed/impatient with their characters now and then.
SHEILA's new outfit is fantabulous, not that she wasn't eye-poppingly fashionable in the past. Now I officially have a hot girl-crush on a cartoon character!!! What else is next?
DEAN manning up (even in his sissified way ,with the tears of rage streaming down his face) defending his love, TRIANA, was a high point of the season so far. I adore that even before his "macho" display, young MS. ORPHEUS was playfully flirting with him a bit.
The fact that the VENTURE brothers have never "seen another teen--ager before" accounts for their all-encompassing dorkiness. They're not socialized in the least...probably learned most of their behaviors from TV and movies (decades worth of corniness and outdated presentations of teen interactions on reruns since the inception of "talkies"). Never gave this much thought before....just got a little annoyed/impatient with their characters now and then.
- by barrytown
- (unregistered id: 936F26E427)
everyone seems to have missed the best part. Walter. Walter Melon. That was the funniest thing ever. Also, yeah, Triana digs Dean. That annoying kid is Brock's son. They weren't even trying to hide it. Why do people continue to think that they'll try to trick us? When have they? That's not their style.
Also, the whole thing with Brock and the moppets, and then he was talking to the Monarch. When he was saying that Doc cries himself to sleep at night, that he really misses Monarch and his henchmen, I get the feeling that, I mean, yeah maybe Venture misses it, but I bet Brock misses it more. I mean, based on how he went off on Hatred's guy. I think he's getting restless. Like maybe Monarch hating Venture made his post not so much of a punishment, now that Hatred's arching Venture it really is. Going back to Hatred being the one who posted him with Venture... at least an interesting coincidence, if not more.
Also, the whole thing with Brock and the moppets, and then he was talking to the Monarch. When he was saying that Doc cries himself to sleep at night, that he really misses Monarch and his henchmen, I get the feeling that, I mean, yeah maybe Venture misses it, but I bet Brock misses it more. I mean, based on how he went off on Hatred's guy. I think he's getting restless. Like maybe Monarch hating Venture made his post not so much of a punishment, now that Hatred's arching Venture it really is. Going back to Hatred being the one who posted him with Venture... at least an interesting coincidence, if not more.
- by Pirate Hippy
- (unregistered id: CA31821874)
Not comparable. They gave us absolutely no hints about what Sheila's revelation was; people just jumped to conclusions (such as that she was pregnant, even though she had said in the very first episode that they had agreed not to have kids) based on ZERO evidence from that episode. Whereas, in this episode we have a TON of evidence that the kid is Brock's son. Don't you see how these two examples are apples to oranges comparison?
Sure, it could turn out to be someone besides Brock is the father - but if they do that, it would be very atypical of JP and DH's writing style.
Sure, it could turn out to be someone besides Brock is the father - but if they do that, it would be very atypical of JP and DH's writing style.
- by That guy! From the Internet!
- (unregistered id: C039DEBA32)
Re: Brock telling the Monarch that Doc misses him. Did anyone else notice that Brock was able to hear the Monarch over Tim-Tom's hidden camera?
Monarch: He does?
Brock: Yeah.
Monarch: Really?
And that's about ten seconds after Dr. Mrs. the Monarch specifically points out that it's a one-way system. Very sloppy, Astrobase!
Monarch: He does?
Brock: Yeah.
Monarch: Really?
And that's about ten seconds after Dr. Mrs. the Monarch specifically points out that it's a one-way system. Very sloppy, Astrobase!
- by Emery Calame
- (unregistered id: BE19DD18F5)
The camera was one way but the Monarach was previously screaming at the moppets to "get on that golf cart thing!" so clearly audio was two way, probably through an earpiece on one of the moppets. Brock was holding onto one of their heads at the time and he has pretty sensitive hearing.
Brock could hear but not see the Monarch, and the Monarch was not clear on that last part.
Brock could hear but not see the Monarch, and the Monarch was not clear on that last part.
- by The Badass Robot
- (unregistered id: 2934BE9D40)
- by That guy! From the Internet!
- (unregistered id: C039DEBA32)
My favorite episode of the season so far. Short on backstory, long on characters acting hilarious. I love that so many characters got brought out and every one of them was put to great use. The OotT's safety presentation, Johnny's rantings, the Moppets' "fucking KNIFE" bit, Brock's fury at Dermitt's taunts, another look into the Monarch's bizarre sex life, Dean's spinning murder top bit (I thought Hank had the retard strength, though?). All excellent.
My favorite throw-away gags came from Sgt. Hatred. Referring to torching shrubs as "pulling a Moses" is a great turn of phrase. And I like that Hatred's henchmen are named by whatever letter or punctuation mark is on their face: Pvt. Schwa, Pvt. Tilde...
My favorite throw-away gags came from Sgt. Hatred. Referring to torching shrubs as "pulling a Moses" is a great turn of phrase. And I like that Hatred's henchmen are named by whatever letter or punctuation mark is on their face: Pvt. Schwa, Pvt. Tilde...
- by Phil
- (unregistered id: 4453D1431A)
Review finally up at www.noisetosignal.org
Second best of the season so far, right behind Hand of Fate.
Second best of the season so far, right behind Hand of Fate.
- by Da7e
- (unregistered id: 90EE92AB4C)
- by hank
- (unregistered id: B4B4ADC2E7)
one thing that really bugged me was that the door to the E-Den first opened in (doc & billy pushing it) then later doc opens the door out (when billy comes stumbling out). even on the first watch that struck me as lazy.
dermott HAS to be brocks kid - for so many obvious reasons. And really - people dont think he looks like brock? come on, how often do kids not look like their parents? its pretty common. One thing though is they both have nice blonde hair.
also a side note - has anyone ever speculated why Dean & Hank have different hair colors and look so different? Im pretty sure this has never been touched upon in an episode and it's bugged me for awhile.
dermott HAS to be brocks kid - for so many obvious reasons. And really - people dont think he looks like brock? come on, how often do kids not look like their parents? its pretty common. One thing though is they both have nice blonde hair.
also a side note - has anyone ever speculated why Dean & Hank have different hair colors and look so different? Im pretty sure this has never been touched upon in an episode and it's bugged me for awhile.
- by THEBIGMAMAFREAK
- (unregistered id: 180DB3087A)
We've never known who HANK & DEAN's original birth mother is. There was that episode (forget the name), where they all get stuck inside DR. VENTURE's pleasure machine and the boys refer to "when MOMMY was alive"...apparently they had a pet dog then too. Not too many clues or red herrings have been given.
In "...HAND OF FATE" when PETE & BILLY visit the young adult DR.VENTURE, we see HELPER as a nanny with the baby VENTURE twins as infants in his robotic arms with their different hair colors.
If anyone remembers more about the original HANK & DEAN or possible birth mother, clue me in.
I own both DVDs and have seen every episode, but I'm not one to go over it all with a fine tooth comb for minutia, though I'd count the show as probably my favorite (along with THE SHIELD). Thanks!
In "...HAND OF FATE" when PETE & BILLY visit the young adult DR.VENTURE, we see HELPER as a nanny with the baby VENTURE twins as infants in his robotic arms with their different hair colors.
If anyone remembers more about the original HANK & DEAN or possible birth mother, clue me in.
I own both DVDs and have seen every episode, but I'm not one to go over it all with a fine tooth comb for minutia, though I'd count the show as probably my favorite (along with THE SHIELD). Thanks!
- by Miller Industries
- (unregistered id: ACBD24991A)
Scamp was their dog. Watch the pilot on the Season 1 DVD.
I think we are to assume that Myra is their mother. Doc admitted he F'd her. She calls them her boys. Her mania has to be founded in some truth.
I want to say that Hank and Dean are so different for the same reasons why Doc and JJ are so different. One is nerdy and a has-been, while the other takes opportunity and is a success. Not all twins look alike. And yes, they are twins. Hank was born a few minutes before Dean. They said so.
The only conclusion I can come up with is that Dermitt is Brock's son. It makes the most sense. I don't think it could be Rust's, since he's only been with one woman (Myra, I assume). Billy is a virgin, so that rules him out. He could be Hatred's. I mean, I see the similarities, but Dermitt didn't know he'd show up. Brock is the best bet.
If you disagree consider this: the episode is very Brock centered and very fatherhood centered. Brock and Doc's convo. Action Johnny talking about his father. Doc scolding Hank about him having sex. Dermitt getting on Brock's nerves. The Father picking up the cloned son. Doc O's convo with Brock.
That's all the evidence I need. But, in reality, who knows? Jackson and Doc H might be trying to pull the woll over our eyes....
I think we are to assume that Myra is their mother. Doc admitted he F'd her. She calls them her boys. Her mania has to be founded in some truth.
I want to say that Hank and Dean are so different for the same reasons why Doc and JJ are so different. One is nerdy and a has-been, while the other takes opportunity and is a success. Not all twins look alike. And yes, they are twins. Hank was born a few minutes before Dean. They said so.
The only conclusion I can come up with is that Dermitt is Brock's son. It makes the most sense. I don't think it could be Rust's, since he's only been with one woman (Myra, I assume). Billy is a virgin, so that rules him out. He could be Hatred's. I mean, I see the similarities, but Dermitt didn't know he'd show up. Brock is the best bet.
If you disagree consider this: the episode is very Brock centered and very fatherhood centered. Brock and Doc's convo. Action Johnny talking about his father. Doc scolding Hank about him having sex. Dermitt getting on Brock's nerves. The Father picking up the cloned son. Doc O's convo with Brock.
That's all the evidence I need. But, in reality, who knows? Jackson and Doc H might be trying to pull the woll over our eyes....
- by Pirate Hippy
- (unregistered id: CA31821874)
All excellent points about fatherhood being a HUGE theme in this episode. Also the continuing theme of failure really does point to Brock being Dermott's father. What bigger failure could it be to Brock to have a son who is a total know-nothing poser who gets beaten up by a spaz like Dean? Brock's the father. If he isn't, JP and DH have a very large rabbit to pull out of their hat to explain away all the false clues.
I agree I lean towards Myra being the mother of Hank and Dean, however, nowhere have JP and DH told us that Rusty has only had sex once, or only with one woman. He said he lost his virginity to a very horrific looking woman - the young Myra is quite nice looking.
Also, in the latest promo we see in next week's episode Rusty about to have sex with a nice looking redhead about his age and he implies that he, or they, have not had sex in 19 years. Maybe at age 24 he lost his virginity to an ugly woman, and had sex with Myra and this other mystery woman as well? I guess we'll have to wait til Friday to learn more.
I agree I lean towards Myra being the mother of Hank and Dean, however, nowhere have JP and DH told us that Rusty has only had sex once, or only with one woman. He said he lost his virginity to a very horrific looking woman - the young Myra is quite nice looking.
Also, in the latest promo we see in next week's episode Rusty about to have sex with a nice looking redhead about his age and he implies that he, or they, have not had sex in 19 years. Maybe at age 24 he lost his virginity to an ugly woman, and had sex with Myra and this other mystery woman as well? I guess we'll have to wait til Friday to learn more.
- by Pirate Hippy
- (unregistered id: CA31821874)
Someone on wiki makes an additional point that we have not mentioned:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dermott_Fictel
***At the end of the episode "The Buddy System", Dermott's mother comes by with a car to pick him up. Dermott and his mother seem to have agreed to come to the camp for the sole purpose of meeting his possible father, and perhaps suggests Dermott has suffered emotionally as a result of not seeing his father, which is evident in his aggressive attitude toward Brock (accusing him of "walking away" when Brock turned around to avoid a confrontation).***
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dermott_Fictel
***At the end of the episode "The Buddy System", Dermott's mother comes by with a car to pick him up. Dermott and his mother seem to have agreed to come to the camp for the sole purpose of meeting his possible father, and perhaps suggests Dermott has suffered emotionally as a result of not seeing his father, which is evident in his aggressive attitude toward Brock (accusing him of "walking away" when Brock turned around to avoid a confrontation).***
- by DeimosMasque
- (unregistered id: DD74F4CF47)
I think people are reading way to in to the "Yeah Walk Away" line.
Having known kids like Dermott, I think the "Yeah walk away" was along the same lines as the "Thug-Henchman" that the Monarch had who said the exact same thing to Hank.
Its basically a phrased used to show how "tough" you are because your antagonist was "too afraid to stand up to you" and that's fine because your so bad ass you'd have severely hurt them if they hadn't "walked away."
Having known kids like Dermott, I think the "Yeah walk away" was along the same lines as the "Thug-Henchman" that the Monarch had who said the exact same thing to Hank.
Its basically a phrased used to show how "tough" you are because your antagonist was "too afraid to stand up to you" and that's fine because your so bad ass you'd have severely hurt them if they hadn't "walked away."
- by Pirate Hippy
- (unregistered id: CA31821874)
That "walk away" comment isn't a single stand alone piece of evidence, it hangs together as part of a much larger web of interconnected and mutually reinforcing pieces of evidence. The theme of fatherhood, the theme of fathers trying to advise Brock, the theme of Brock's own lack of completion as a father (he's still playing the role of school yard bully when talking with Dr. Orpheus; he hasn't taken on the role of father yet, in spite of playing surrogate parent to Hank and Dean), the theme of sons and fathers not getting along, it all goes together as a package. If that "walk away" line was the only bit of evidence, you might have a point - but it isn't. There's a whole long laundry list of evidence we've mentioned in this thread and also listed on the wiki. It all hangs together. If Brock as father turns out to be false, JP and DH have a whole lot of explaining to do. Not saying it can't happen, just saying it is unlikely, given their past record as writers of The Venture Brothers.
- by Pirate Hippy
- (unregistered id: CA31821874)
I've known families where the children are a mix of blond and red headed children - it's perfectly common to get both traits from the parents and grandparents in the same set of siblings. I don't see anything odd about Hank and Dean being children of Rusty (red headed) and Myra (blond). It's simple genetics. Kids take on characteristics from both sides of the family going many generations back, so you can have siblings that don't look much like each other.
However, interestingly, promo for next week's episode shows Rusty "getting it on" in a tent with what appears to be a red headed old flame and he mentions something about the last time they had sex (or he had sex; unclear) being 19 years, 2 months, so many days, etc. So maybe Myra isn't the mother, or maybe Hank and Dean have different mothers, or something. We'll see soon enough.
However, interestingly, promo for next week's episode shows Rusty "getting it on" in a tent with what appears to be a red headed old flame and he mentions something about the last time they had sex (or he had sex; unclear) being 19 years, 2 months, so many days, etc. So maybe Myra isn't the mother, or maybe Hank and Dean have different mothers, or something. We'll see soon enough.
- by BFunk
- (unregistered id: C0427C099F)
I saw that promo too. She (presumably Dr. Quymn) wasn't "horrific" or anything, but we don't know what she looked like 19 years ago. For all we know she could have looked much worse back then but gotten into better shape or something at this point. Just speculation. Either way, I think it's pretty clear that she's the one Rusty lost his virginity to.
Interesting point about Hank and Dean possibly having different mothers. That hadn't occurred to me before but now that you mention it, I could definitely see Dr. Quymn being Dean's mother and Myra being Hank's mother. That would explain the hair colors and differences in personality between the two (not that their differences necessarily need an explanation).
Interesting point about Hank and Dean possibly having different mothers. That hadn't occurred to me before but now that you mention it, I could definitely see Dr. Quymn being Dean's mother and Myra being Hank's mother. That would explain the hair colors and differences in personality between the two (not that their differences necessarily need an explanation).
- by Pirate Hippy
- (unregistered id: CA31821874)
Yeah I was just throwing out an idea there since there now seems to be both a blond and a redhead in Rusty's sex life. I wasn't being that serious. Obviously the fact that Hank and Dean are always referred to as 'the Venture twins' makes it highly unlikely they have different mothers, without having to do a lot of extra explaining that wouldn't sound very convincing. We still haven't been told definitively who the mother is, though the evidence so far still points strongly towards Myra (based on her appearance in the Hand of Fate episode).
- by That Guy! From the Internet!
- (unregistered id: C039DEBA32)
I'm gonna go out on a limb and guess that "Action" Johnny is Dermott's father. His being stuck in the bathysphere for most of his life would account for his being an absent father. The blond hair is then a match, and Dermott's physique could be from his mother's side. I think that putting Johnny in the situation would be closer to the failure theme, too: it'd be a nice reveal that a screwed-up man-child with absentee father issues would be forced to accept an unknown son.
Maybe I'm just hoping that Dermott isn't Brock's son. Between Jonas/Doc and Doc/Hank & Dean, we have enough fucked-up father-son relationships in the main cast already. It wouldn't add anything to the show to force Brock into the same relationship. Brock's already one of the most competent father-figures in the show anyway when looking after the boys.
And anyway, I think the implications are just too-heavy handed. It's so obvious that we're meant to think Dermott is Brock's son, and it just seems to be setting up a curveball later in the season.
Maybe I'm just hoping that Dermott isn't Brock's son. Between Jonas/Doc and Doc/Hank & Dean, we have enough fucked-up father-son relationships in the main cast already. It wouldn't add anything to the show to force Brock into the same relationship. Brock's already one of the most competent father-figures in the show anyway when looking after the boys.
And anyway, I think the implications are just too-heavy handed. It's so obvious that we're meant to think Dermott is Brock's son, and it just seems to be setting up a curveball later in the season.
- by Mike
- (unregistered id: 027D18FA77)
Why is everyone expecting a 'curveball' from this show? When have they ever done that? Hank & Dean being clones was made fairly obvious throughout season one and people kept calling it too obvious and then it turned out they were clones. Dr. Girlfriend's confession at the end of season two was pretty much nothing that anyone predicted. Jonas Jr. was hinted at throughout season one, etc.
The show keeps secrets about the characters for sure, but it hasn't ever purposely hinted at one thing only to go "gottcha!" and it turns out to be something totally different. Everything that has been a surprise (like David Bowie being Sovereign) was never hinted at prior to the reveal.
The show keeps secrets about the characters for sure, but it hasn't ever purposely hinted at one thing only to go "gottcha!" and it turns out to be something totally different. Everything that has been a surprise (like David Bowie being Sovereign) was never hinted at prior to the reveal.
- by hank
- (unregistered id: B4B4ADC2E7)
"Maybe I'm just hoping that Dermott isn't Brock's son. Between Jonas/Doc and Doc/Hank & Dean, we have enough fucked-up father-son relationships in the main cast already. It wouldn't add anything to the show to force Brock into the same relationship. Brock's already one of the most competent father-figures in the show anyway when looking after the boys."
Yeah but maybe that is what they are going to do with Dermit & Brock. Perhaps brock will accept dermit and their relationship will turn into the only "healthy" father-son relationship the show has ever seen.
maybe thats the curveball youre looking for.
Yeah but maybe that is what they are going to do with Dermit & Brock. Perhaps brock will accept dermit and their relationship will turn into the only "healthy" father-son relationship the show has ever seen.
maybe thats the curveball youre looking for.
- by Spncr Trcy
- (unregistered id: 77237BE0DD)
First off, I have to agree with everybody who says that Dermit is
Billy's son. It's just good writing. Why would you (or the writers)
want this kid to be Brock's son? The writers are smart enough to know
that no fan wants to see Dermit tear down Brock's awesome character by being a lameass. But what about Billy? You take a relatively unexplored character from the last two seasons (even Pete was in on the college flashbacks), give him an origin episode (yes, Hand Of Fate was definitely a Billy origin episode), and then bulk up his character and backstory by making him an amnesiac OSI secret agent who unknowingly fathered a child. You know why that's good writing? Because you can already imagine the great jokes that they would make between Billy and Dermit. Giant annoying son with tiny naive father meeting and getting to know/hate one another. That's comedy. Also, making Dermit Brock's son would be like revealing that Dr. Girlfriend was a man. It's just way too obvious and this kind of extreme misdirection is a staple of the show.
Also, these posts brought up a weird idea. What if Brock is Hank's
father and Doc Venture is Dean's father? Maybe Myra is the mother and
somehow Brock and Doc both got her pregnant at the same time (it is
possible in reality). That wouldn't be too out of step with everything
else that happens in their world.
Billy's son. It's just good writing. Why would you (or the writers)
want this kid to be Brock's son? The writers are smart enough to know
that no fan wants to see Dermit tear down Brock's awesome character by being a lameass. But what about Billy? You take a relatively unexplored character from the last two seasons (even Pete was in on the college flashbacks), give him an origin episode (yes, Hand Of Fate was definitely a Billy origin episode), and then bulk up his character and backstory by making him an amnesiac OSI secret agent who unknowingly fathered a child. You know why that's good writing? Because you can already imagine the great jokes that they would make between Billy and Dermit. Giant annoying son with tiny naive father meeting and getting to know/hate one another. That's comedy. Also, making Dermit Brock's son would be like revealing that Dr. Girlfriend was a man. It's just way too obvious and this kind of extreme misdirection is a staple of the show.
Also, these posts brought up a weird idea. What if Brock is Hank's
father and Doc Venture is Dean's father? Maybe Myra is the mother and
somehow Brock and Doc both got her pregnant at the same time (it is
possible in reality). That wouldn't be too out of step with everything
else that happens in their world.
- by Mike
- (unregistered id: 1810A2A1DF)
Jackson and Doc have said multiple times that Hank & Dean are both Dr. Venture's sons. Hank is not a clone of Brock or anything. Anyway Invisible Hand of Fate showed the boys as babies before Brock was assigned as Doc's bodyguard, and the only previous interaction Brock and Rusty had was they were roommates in college for a semester (if even that long). Hank is Dr. Venture's son, say it with me now :P
- by hank
- (unregistered id: B4B4ADC2E7)
"It's just way too obvious and this kind of extreme misdirection is a staple of the show."
have you ever watched Venture Brothers? "extreme misdirection" a staple of the show?!@?# you've got to be kidding me. either you are the thickest person and never understood any clues (Doc's dream about eating something inside the womb) or you've watched old episodes maybe one time through. holy shit what a wrong statement.
do they do it - every once in a while - but a staple? hahaa.
have you ever watched Venture Brothers? "extreme misdirection" a staple of the show?!@?# you've got to be kidding me. either you are the thickest person and never understood any clues (Doc's dream about eating something inside the womb) or you've watched old episodes maybe one time through. holy shit what a wrong statement.
do they do it - every once in a while - but a staple? hahaa.
- by Gor
- (unregistered id: 50B6BDC487)
I agree, because when someone says "extreme misdirection" I'm thinking M. Night Shyamalan. Most of the Venture Brother's so-called "misdirections" I would call mild surprises. The two biggest surprises were about Jonas Jr. & the boys being clones, and they dropped enough hints that it wasn't that much of a surprise, but were very entertaining.
- by Pirate Hippy
- (unregistered id: CA31821874)
That probably explains why I've not bothered to watch M. Night Shyamalan yet.
Yeah reading these threads I really do have to wonder what show some people have been watching, because it sure wasn't the Venture Brothers. Mild misdirection here and there? Sure. Ambiguity that allows people to jump to false conclusions? Sure. "Extreme misdirection"??? Nope. Not yet. It could happen, but it would set a precedent. JP and DH haven't done this to us yet.
Yeah reading these threads I really do have to wonder what show some people have been watching, because it sure wasn't the Venture Brothers. Mild misdirection here and there? Sure. Ambiguity that allows people to jump to false conclusions? Sure. "Extreme misdirection"??? Nope. Not yet. It could happen, but it would set a precedent. JP and DH haven't done this to us yet.
- by Roscoe
- (unregistered id: BD83BFB0C7)
Best Episode since The Doctor Is Sin. There was so much greatness in this episode I don't know where to begin.
Hanks Teen-AGER line, The Order Of The Triad Safety PSA, Doc having Billy crawl around like a cat, Dean Going Apeshit on Dermott, 100% Great Episode.
Did anybody else notice that Billy's Robotic Forarm turned into just a Robotic hand in this episode?
Hanks Teen-AGER line, The Order Of The Triad Safety PSA, Doc having Billy crawl around like a cat, Dean Going Apeshit on Dermott, 100% Great Episode.
Did anybody else notice that Billy's Robotic Forarm turned into just a Robotic hand in this episode?
- by RetroWarbird
- (unregistered id: C455788739)
I'm really thinking Sergeant Hatred is going to wind up being Dermott's father. The awkward relationship between a militaristic father and son, with the whole "can't be around children pedophilia" angle, and sharing awkward stories with his Arch, Dr. Venture about their kids would be priceless. Brock seemed a little too obvious and a Red Herring for me ... and Hatred had about 30 seconds of visibility for Dermott at the end of the Day Camp, but could be the mother instigated the Hatred raid on an off day on purpose to give young Dermott a glimpse at the old Sarge.
Plus how many jilted, freak-show exes does Rusty need? He has Myra already ... that's enough. Although I did notice they kind of played up the "third brother" angle a little as a Red Herring too.
By the way, Dean's been kicking ass this season on the Triana Orpheus front ...
Plus how many jilted, freak-show exes does Rusty need? He has Myra already ... that's enough. Although I did notice they kind of played up the "third brother" angle a little as a Red Herring too.
By the way, Dean's been kicking ass this season on the Triana Orpheus front ...
- by RetroWarbird
- (unregistered id: C455788739)
PLUS ... lending more credence to the Sgt. Hatred angle ...
We did just see Hatred was in OSI and outranked Brock, firing him, back in The Invisible Hand of Fate, secretly worked for the Guild, and his name is actually Haige. Dermott Haige?
Anyway, Hatred was BlackOps too ... badda-bing.
We did just see Hatred was in OSI and outranked Brock, firing him, back in The Invisible Hand of Fate, secretly worked for the Guild, and his name is actually Haige. Dermott Haige?
Anyway, Hatred was BlackOps too ... badda-bing.
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